Am I a Bad Coach? Spotting the Signs & Fixing What’s Broken

Angie: 00:00:00

John,

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John: Angie.

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Angie: Have you ever had

coaching That wasn't good.

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John: Yeah, more than once.

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Angie: So what did you do?

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John: I told the authorities that they

were harboring aliens from another planet

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and they were never heard from again.

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Angie: No.

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What did you really do?

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John: I sacked my coach

and I told them why I.

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Angie: So did that feel awkward?

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John: Oh yes.

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It would've been way better

if I'd spotted the issues

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beforehand and there were clues.

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Angie: So this should be fun.

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Let's open up the coaching clinic.

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John: now.

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I definitely had coaches.

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I've had to sack Angie, how about you?

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Have you ever had that experience

of just not getting great coaching?

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I.

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Angie: I have to say yes and yes.

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There was coaching that I had, that

I actually wasn't, I didn't pay for,

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it was provided to me by a company

and it was the worst, but I didn't

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necessarily know it was the worst.

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I just felt very frustrated by it.

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John: Mm.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: I probably have said this at

some point on the show before, but

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of the worst coaching I ever had was

from people who are reading a script,

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taking you through just a process and

very, very rigidly sticking to that.

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And they're just waiting for you to shut

up so they can ask you the next part

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Angie: Oh my gosh.

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That's awful.

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Yeah.

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John: hate that.

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You know, when you can tell that

they're reading what they're saying

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to you as well, so it doesn't even

sound natural when they're doing it.

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that stuff is crazy.

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You know, I've had

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Angie: Do you feel like you're calling

a customer service one 800 number and

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they're like, yes ma'am, I understand.

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Please allow me to, you know, X, Y, Z.

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John: The tonality of these bots.

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Automatic callers.

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Yeah.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: when you know it's not a real

person that you're speaking to,

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that's what it ended up sounded like.

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So yeah, that was horrible.

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Coaching where it's just been

ineffective and the coach has just.

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I dunno, don't feel like

coaches should be enablers.

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You know,

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: sometimes you need to

call stuff out with people.

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It really brought up this whole thing

for me when we were thinking about

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what we're gonna talk about today

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: I think we have, as coaches, we tend

to have those imposter syndrome moments,

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those insecurities of am I a good coach?

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Am I a bad coach?

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We don't always know, and we may feel

differently about it on different days.

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Well, maybe it's something

we could get into.

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How would you know, what would be

the clues that you are a bad coach?

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What do you think?

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Angie: Yeah, so first of all, let

me say this though, because I know

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that for everybody that listens, they

might feel a little bit differently

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than we do, but I don't think it's

always so obvious and I do think that

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some, what I think is a great coach is

probably gonna be very different than

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even what you think is a great coach.

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So it's, I think it's a very

individual thing for me.

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Kind of talking about what you

said earlier, I really feel

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the need to be challenged.

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if I'm like sitting here going, ask

me this while we're in a coachee

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session, then I know it's a bad session.

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Like if I know where you should

be going and I know that's

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because I have Coach Brain, right?

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I am a coach naturally.

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I think I wanted to talk about what you

said earlier because, I had worked, and

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I think you have worked, we've worked for

companies where there was a structure,

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a program of process to follow, and I

experienced coaches who were very script

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oriented and not great coaches, like

just going through the motions reading

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line by line, and not using the program

or the process as more of the guide.

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Rather than this is the session too rigid.

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And I think that is probably, unless you

are a cons, if you're a consultant, we've

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talked about this on our show, there

are some key differentiators between

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being a consultant and being a coach.

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And if I want a consultant,

that's who I'm going to hire.

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I'll hire a marketing consultant.

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I'll hire a, if I'm looking to be

coached, it means that I can't get

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out of my own way, and I need the

expertise of somebody that is going

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to help me get out of my own way.

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So yeah.

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John: yeah, I think this,

not necessarily complicated.

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I don't want it to be

something that's complicated.

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I think really my take on this is more.

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There may be things that we could

generate awareness of where we have

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room for improvement, things that

are fixable, but there probably are

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things that, for some people are

not going to be fixable and might

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Angie: Me

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John: coaching actually isn't the right.

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Place for you to be.

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Angie: Sure.

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John: I don't anticipate that our listener

is gonna be in the latter category.

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I think probably most of the stuff you'll

encounter that you may be judging yourself

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as a bad coach over is probably fixable.

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And especially if you are prepared

to put in the work and do it,

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and if you are committed to being

as good a coach as you can be.

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You know, we all know we're probably

all better coaches than we were

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last year or the year before.

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Depend on how long

you've been coaching, but

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Angie: Sure.

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John: certainly for most of us from

when we first started, you're a better

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coach now than you were then, and that

will be true in the future as well.

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But as much as I say I've had bad

coaching, I've had amazing coaches as well

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: blown me away and just think,

I wish I could coach more like them.

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Because I would love to be more,

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: like them.

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Then there's certainly things that

I've taken from those coaching

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experiences that I've brought into

my own coaching as best I could.

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'cause I can't be them.

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I don't want to be them.

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But, I would like to at least

work at getting to their level.

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And I don't know that I will,

but I'm gonna work on it.

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I'm gonna stay committed to that thing.

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So think.

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When I talk about, a bad coach,

really, it is more from the

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perspective of how we judge ourselves.

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Are you judging yourself as a bad coach?

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And if you are, should

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Angie: Hmm.

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No, and listen, I think that if

you are truly a committed coach.

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You're not somebody who's just

looking to create an assembly line

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of clients that you can just, take

money from and, oh, this is great.

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I have six clients now I'm

making this much a week.

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And like, if you are dedicated to

the craft, I think that we do have

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to give ourselves that grace that

we will grow and improve the things

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we would expect of our clients.

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Right.

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We, reason they're, they're

with us is to grow and escalate

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and, and all of those things.

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But I think we put a little bit of

an unrealistic pressure on ourselves

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that we have to be at some higher

level, all the time without the grace

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of, and we've talked about this, like

making mistakes and learning from them,

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self-evaluation, things like that.

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Yeah.

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I think, what does it even look like?

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I did have one coach who was,

he was fantastic with me.

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I don't know what he

did with everybody else.

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I just knew that he was great with me,

but it was because I needed the type

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of coaching that he provided because.

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I am super self-aware.

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I do get bored.

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I, be sitting there twirling my

hair going, is this other person

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gonna ask me the question or what?

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Whereas this other person,

his name was John by the way.

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John made me insanely uncomfortable

and although I have to be

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honest, resisted it initially.

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He also then had the awareness

of like, well, you lead this.

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This is why we're doing what we're doing.

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You realize that, right?

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And he changed everything.

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So again, but that's for me, not everybody

responds well to that type of coaching.

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So it really is kind of developing

your own, I don't know what

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the word is, your own way.

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Who are you, who's your

persona as a coach?

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John: That's really the danger of

judging ourselves against other,

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more experienced coaches that we

come with who we think are good.

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Even then, they're not gonna

be everybody's cup of tea.

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Nobody can be

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Angie: Yeah.

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Hmm.

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John: is going to love and value and think

they're amazing and that they're, see this

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in the personal development world as well.

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Like people, public figures

in personal development.

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There are some we love and

some we hate and we don't

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: On who those people are.

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Angie: Sure.

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John: fine.

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But when you're comparing yourself to

them, comparison being the thief of

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joy and all of that, and it really is.

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What you are also not considering is

that you might actually be the perfect

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coach for the clients that you're

working with, more than they might be.

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And so we

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: against saying, well,

I'm not as good as them.

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So I'm a, a bad coach?

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Ever gonna be that good?

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You are you, and you wanna be

the best you that you can be.

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And I think, would say this,

similarly to you, I knew a coach.

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I trained under him to some degree.

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He was a bit of a mentor figure for

me, was amazing at provocative therapy.

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had trained with Tad James on

timeline therapy and stuff like that.

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Was great at doing, there was

a stage hypnotist would teach,

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help teach me hypnosis and stage

techniques and things like that.

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A great person to learn from

completely unreliable with his clients

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Angie: Oh.

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John: and.

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And so when he showed up, he could be

an amazing coach, although, like you

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said, made people very uncomfortable.

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That's not for everybody.

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I responded to it so did lot.

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A lot of people who worked with him

and they loved him for that, but

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you didn't know for sure that he

was gonna show up for the sessions.

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Angie: Really listen and wait.

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It's so funny you brought that up because,

I, speaking, coaching, I had an event that

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I had to cancel last minute very recently,

and I'm still sick to my stomach over it.

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I mean, it was unavoidable.

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There was, we had a little

bit of an emergency, a medical

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emergency in the family.

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I didn't have a choice and it made me

sick to my stomach because I tell my

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clients before they start working with

me, if I ever no show I'm probably dead.

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I don't do it.

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I don't cancel, I don't, no show.

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And then I set a pretty

high standard for them.

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Like, don't not show, but for a coach

to set the standard and be the, I

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couldn't put up with that for three

seconds, like that bad coaching because,

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I've seen it, I've heard people say,

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there are people, we're all human first.

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Right?

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I always say that we are coaches, we

are, human life still happens to us.

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Although I think we try to put up,

that's why I'm still sick to my stomach.

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It's unrealistic.

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Idea that we are supposed to, to

some degree, set the standard.

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This is the way it is.

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You show up, but that in and of

itself could make you a bad coach.

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Like, I don't wanna deal with you.

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I don't wanna pay for you.

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You're unreliable.

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Therefore, it diminishes any.

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Professional, what's the

word I'm looking for here?

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I'm losing all my words.

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I'm not bad from vacation, everybody.

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I'm just saying anyhow.

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But it diminishes.

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Yes, thank you for all those

easy words, but it's the truth.

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Like, all of a sudden it's

like, you're really not you.

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You're not all that anymore.

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Just because of that, it's completely

disrespectful and all the things when

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that happens and, but at the same time,

right, life does happen too, but it can't

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be habitual that you're not showing up.

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John: Exactly.

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And I think if that's the

situation, I don't think it can

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always be that life's happening.

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It can't, that

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Angie: Sure.

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John: your ex your excuse for

being kind of flaky as a coach.

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You need, you need to

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: the work at least most of the time

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: need to be able to trust that

you actually care about them and

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you care about working with them

and helping them get the results.

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And if you are not

reliable to the most part.

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People will let you off once

or twice, but they won't keep

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: without, without a very good

Now if they need, some people have

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health conditions and stuff like

that, they end up having to take

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breaks from coaching all the time.

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Angie: Right.

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John: you're probably gonna let your

clients know something about that so

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that they know what to expect rather than

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Angie: Yes, correct.

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John: So, I think that

when, I'm a bad coach.

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I think if you don't really

care about your clients and

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Angie: Oh

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John: Their best interest at heart.

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I think that's probably what

would make you a bad coach.

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If you just

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Angie: yeah.

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John: don't, I don't

care about your results.

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I just want your money.

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would be in my books.

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Yeah.

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You're pretty much a bad coach.

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You're disrespecting your clients.

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You are, letting people

down and yourself as well.

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Even if you have all the best

coaching skills, that doesn't mean

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you're gonna be an amazing coach.

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Angie: So interesting because I

think that because our industry is

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growing and we've talked statistics.

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I think the last time I actually

looked, it's been so since.

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Two, 2019.

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The industry has grown by over 500% COVID.

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There are things that, made that happen.

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The industry was growing as it was,

but that just gave it a nice shove.

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And I have to say this, and if anybody out

there feels offended when I say it, maybe

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we're talking to that person to be honest.

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But, I think that a lot

of people diminish the.

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Relationship that we have sometimes

with people as coaches, meaning

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don't come in and just think

like, oh, I can just be a coach.

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Because I feel like that just diminishes

the art of the act, the people who

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are actually professional coaches, the

reason I'm saying this is I have heard

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people say that and it infuriates me.

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I'm like.

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What do you mean?

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Just be a coach?

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I mean, certainly we've

made the joke, right?

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We're not rocket scientists.

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Maybe some people are, I don't know.

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But generally we're not, and intensive

brain surgery that we do, but we're

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affecting people's lives and it is

such a, an important job to have.

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And when I hear people diminish that,

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or minimize it.

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It really makes me look at them

and think, you are not a coach.

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You're just here for the money grab.

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You're here because some, to, some people

charge hundreds if not thousands of

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dollars per session and want the money

grab because it's air quotes, easy to do.

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That is a really bad coach, that doesn't

really take consideration to the craft.

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I.

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John: there is a sort of opposite

of that, which isn't, I wouldn't say

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it's something that makes someone a

bad coach, but it does make somebody

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less than they can be as a coach,

which is undervaluing themselves

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Angie: mm.

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John: not, not getting themselves out

there enough to get the kind of client

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work that they, they want and that they

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Angie: Sure.

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John: If you don't yourself out there,

it's not, it's not gonna magically.

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Come to you like you have

to build the business.

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So there are, I think

there are people who don't.

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Really enjoy the business

work of coaching.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: a bad coach, but it does make you

a, an ineffective coach if you don't

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actually have the clients or if you're

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Angie: Yeah,

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John: free stuff, or if you're still

charging, 75 bucks an hour for,

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for coaching clients and you've

been doing it for 10 years, it is

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Angie: sure.

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John: not, something's not right there.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: change it.

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This is the what I mean about

the stuff that's fixable.

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This is the stuff that's fixable,

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: the decision that you

want to fix it and that you

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want to be better because of it.

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And it's better for you.

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It's better for clients.

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It's better for your future clients

who will get results from working with

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Angie: Right.

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John: You will feel amazing about it,

and it's okay to have the imposter

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syndrome stuff and question yourself.

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That's still gonna come up, but.

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You'll ride it out because your

clients will help you to do that.

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Your work will help you to do that.

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Angie: Well, I think you

have to just pay attention.

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We talk about this so much.

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I notice it's coming up

a lot, just naturally and

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organically in our talks here.

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It's interesting that I.

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We really do have to give ourselves

that grace to grow, right?

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That imposter syndrome can pop up at

any time during the duration of your

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career, because if you're growing,

you're going to feel uncomfortable.

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You know, if you need to grow,

you're in the next stage,

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whatever you wanna call it.

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I think that that's what happens.

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I think that sometimes

we go, oh, wait a minute.

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We did something.

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We did it well.

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We learned it well.

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And now it's uncomfortable to go and

be better and do better and do more.

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So I think imposter syndrome

can pop up pretty often.

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It's not a one and done,

you know what I mean?

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I think a lot of people feel like, if I

can just get past this, I'll feel better.

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And then, you know, three years

into their career, they're kind

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of feeling like, I don't know, am

I really doing the right thing?

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Because there's more to

jail and they know that.

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John: Yeah, there, also a weird

idea about, and a lot of us carry

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with it, I've dealt with it as well.

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Maybe it's come up for you

about this thing of feeling like

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whether we deserve things or not.

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That question that comes up of, I

deserve this or I don't deserve this.

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That comes up

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: And in all honesty.

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None of us deserve anything.

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It's not about,

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: or not deserves.

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: 00:17:34

We might make judgments of,

well, they're a bad person.

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They don't deserve good things,

or they're a good person.

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They don't deserve bad things.

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But that's not how life

and the world works.

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It's

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: deserving.

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Those are judgments we make on ourselves.

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And sometimes it's a judgment, and with

judgment we make on others as well.

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But sometimes it's a

judgment that stop sales.

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Moving forward as well and

creates those imposter syndrome

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: of, I'm not good enough.

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I don't deserve

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Angie: Sharon,

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John: plus a month, whatever.

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: 00:17:59

That's,

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: 00:18:00

Angie: who am I?

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: 00:18:01

John: people are.

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: 00:18:01

Yeah.

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A li it is definitely a

limiting belief that needs

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Angie: Very limiting.

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John: fixable.

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It is fixable.

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That's the good news.

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All of it is fixable, but it

requires doing some work maybe with

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Angie: Mm-hmm.

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: 00:18:13

John: to help bust through those 'cause

that ultimately is what this is all about.

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Reframe them,

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: and work with the

coach who work for you.

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Angie: Absolutely.

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: 00:18:24

Well, I think we touched on some things

and we always find new things to talk

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about for sure, but we would love to

hear your input and hear what you know.

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: 00:18:32

For the newer coaches or maybe coaches

that have been around for a while, like.

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: 00:18:36

What are your biggest

challenges right now as a coach?

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: 00:18:39

Is it the business?

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: 00:18:40

Is it the coaching?

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: 00:18:41

Is it your style?

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: 00:18:42

Is it a combination?

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: 00:18:43

We'd love to hear that.

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: 00:18:45

John: Let us know certainly come and

check out our new YouTube channel as well.

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: 00:18:48

Just look up the coaching

clinic on YouTube.

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: 00:18:50

You'll find us

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: 00:18:51

Woo.

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: 00:18:52

You can check out our videos,

our podcast episodes there.

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: 00:18:55

We'll put clips up there as well

and come and share and comment

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: 00:18:58

and connect with us there.

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: 00:18:59

We'd love to see you.