Mindful Coaching During Global Turbulence

John: 00:00:00

Angie.

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Angie: John.

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John: I don't know if you've noticed,

but the world seems to be competing for

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most stressful headline of the week.

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Angie: Right.

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It's like every time you refresh

the news, you need to like lie down.

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And meanwhile, coaches are

supposed to just smile and

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ask, so what are your goals?

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John: exactly, it feels, it feels a bit

off to talk about productivity hacks when

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the half the planet feels like it's on

fire, and yet that's the job, isn't it?

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People come to us for support, but

they don't leave the chaos at the door.

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Angie: Yeah, and that's where

coaches either freeze, they fumble,

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or they find a way to actually hold

space and still be useful, which is

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what we're gonna dive into today.

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How to coach when big

world events are happening.

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John: Yeah, basically how to avoid

being the coach equivalent of saying,

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don't worry, just manifest better vibes.

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Angie: Okay.

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Please, no toxic positivity here.

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Let's dig in.

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John: So Angie, it's,

it's just a fact of life.

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That, that, well, I think

there's a lot, been a lot of big

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world events going on recently.

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A lot of big things in the news,

but our clients don't leave the

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world at the door when they come

into their coaching sessions.

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So whether it's, uh, pandemics,

um, mass shootings, uh, climate

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Angie: hmm.

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John: whatever is going on is stuff

that can be playing on people's minds.

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How do we deal with that?

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I mean, we have both coached

people through the pandemic and

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through other things that have

been going on in the world.

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And how do you deal

with that with clients?

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Um, where, where do you

even start to address that?

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Angie: Yeah, I mean, it's so

interesting because, you know, my

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go-to with clients that are, let's

just say they've experienced something

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personal that's negative, right?

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Depending, I think we even touched on

this a few times, but you know, if there

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was a death in the family and, and it

was this morning and they wanna show

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up for their nine o'clock session, I'm

the one that's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

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Right.

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We still need to honor ourselves while

being responsible, and part of that

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is to protect ourselves and right.

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So I think that's one side

of the spectrum, but I feel

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like there's a bigger side.

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You and I have talked about this

personally, like the world seems to

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be right when the world is happening

or things, events are happening, all

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of a sudden it's just like there's

something in the air and you as a coach.

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Have to decide how to progress the

same way you would if somebody came

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into a session with, you know, some

event that happened to them personally

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while remaining, and this is a huge,

we'll get to this, but huge for me as a

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coach, a huge awareness that I am human

first also, and it can create so many

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levels to this topic, actually, right.

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John: But the, the thing is, world events

undoubtedly have the potential to derail

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someone's progress, whatever they're

working on, derail the session completely.

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If there's something

going on for a client.

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And, and I think it is important,

'cause I, I don't know about you,

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but I'm, you know, saying last time,

last which time we spoke, I'm Mr.

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Zen.

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I'm Mr.

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Larry.

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I generally don't let the world.

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Get to me that much.

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Um, I have a very stoic philosophy

kind of approach to life.

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And so I tend to take stuff as it comes

and appreciate what's good in life and

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accept what's not, uh, change what I can

change and, um, live with what I can't

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because I don't see what else we can do.

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And I don't like spending my

time and my life worrying.

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I have that and I, I feel

like I'm pretty centered in my

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inner peace most of the time.

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But if I make the assumption that

my clients also have that, that's

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unfair to them because there's a good

chance that they don't and stuff may

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be going on that is getting to them.

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So it is important to, I think we

always have this temptation, this all.

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It comes from theory of mind of, um, we

need to understand that not everybody

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has the knowledge or the facilities, the

emotional resources that we may have.

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And we may need to check in on that.

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And we can look for, we can look for

verbal clues for, uh, body language

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clues or, you know, sometimes it

would just be very plainly spoken.

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Something's on their mind.

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They, they'll seem distracted

and you maybe wanna ask, is there

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something else going on for you?

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Angie: for example, right,

mark, the date right today is,

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uh, September the 17th of 2025.

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And I've had, in the last week or

so, several challenging sessions

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with clients, and those challenging

sessions have forced me as a coach

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to at least reexamine my approach.

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So what does that mean for

me, at the, at least at the.

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Uh, onset of a coaching session.

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When things are going on,

do I intentionally, should I

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intentionally check in and say.

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Hey, how are you today given, right,

and not, maybe that's not how you would

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say it, but like, do I go in as a coach

and, and talk about the elephant in the

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room or the elephant in the world, or do

I go on and business as usual with the.

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And I had this happen, which

is why I'm bringing it up.

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When I did go in as, Hey, how are you?

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Do you know, let's talk about

the week and my normal routine

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with this particular client.

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They were a little bit upset with

me that I still wanted to go through

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their progress and kind of what,

you know, we talked about in the,

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in the introduction today, so.

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And again, it was not a big deal.

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We, you know, we worked through

it and I shared my perspective,

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but it really opened my mind to,

I really need to think about this.

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How do I want to approach

somebody in a session if there

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is something, you know, going on?

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Right.

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We've talked about coaching

through COVID and um.

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At that time, many people were just

coming forward and going, oh my gosh.

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You know, I know three families

that have COVID now, and, and

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fear mon like fear, major fear.

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And it was a little bit challenging

because as a coach, I think ultimately

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we don't want to feed into the

fear or whatever the emotion is.

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But as we talked about in one of our

most recent episodes, still holding

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space and I'm being honest, I with, with

world events and things as they are,

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I am rethinking my approach actively.

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John: I, I'll say this, uh, I don't always

do this, but I have done it a lot and,

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and I tend to roll with my gut instinct

on it when I do, and that is to sometimes

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ask a client, is there something going

on for you or something you'd like to.

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Discuss before we get into our, what we

come here to talk to work on today, uh,

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before we get into our main session.

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So I said I won't do it a hundred percent

of the time, but I don't always get

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a sense of when I should and whenever

I do, sometimes it's just a couple

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of minutes of them saying, oh, okay,

actually this is on my mind and, uh, this,

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this stuff's been going on this week.

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And so, you know, uh, and we can say if,

if relevant, we say, all right, is that

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something you wanna talk about today?

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Or shall we, um, move into other things?

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Great.

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It could end up being your session if it

makes sense to do that, but it might not.

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It might not, but I do think sometimes

it's good to clear the space for them

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a bit and say, all right, rather than,

rather than being like you having to hold

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it and say, no, this thing's going on.

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It's driving me crazy.

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They've had a chance to express that.

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It's like, okay, well we can maybe

just put it, put it to aside for a

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bit, or maybe we will actually make

it the theme of today's session.

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Angie: it's such a slippery slope.

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I'm being honest.

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'cause I agree with that.

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You know, I, I, I do want to hold

space and I don't want to pour

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into a cup of anger, negativity,

like whatever the emotion is.

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Um, unless of course it's positive

if somebody comes to a session and

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says, huh, I'm a grandma or a grandpa.

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And I just, you know, this morning

and I will do a check-in and say,

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well, do you need to be with family?

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Because, and not because I'm letting

them off the hook, so to speak, but,

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you know, emotions are hard to override.

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I wanna have and deliver the best,

um, the very best session that I can.

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And I think it's something is personal and

very individual, depending on the client,

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on how you handle things like that.

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When it's negative, it's much

harder I think, to navigate through.

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And um, and I've also been forced,

so you and I wear our coaching

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uniforms, if you will, with pride.

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We do.

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We're very proud of what

we do and how we do it.

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We're always learning, looking

to learn more, be better.

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And one of the things that I

have carried very close to me.

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Is as a coach being as

objective as I possibly can.

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So during the course of this particular

week, I have been challenged.

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In big ways, and I've been challenged

in the past, don't get me wrong, I've

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had people come in and, I mean, I don't

know that have come in with ideals or

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sharing pieces of themselves that are

in polar, like they're polar opposition

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of where I sit in a particular space

and it's fine, and it's been fine.

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But like I'm saying, recently, I've had

some opportunities come forth that I'm

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like, Ooh, why is this one, why is this

particular thing hitting me differently?

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How do I as a coach remain

objective for my client?

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I have to, otherwise, I'm done.

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I'm dead in the water.

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And again, you know, there might

be people listening that are like.

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Assuming what they think they know.

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So don't do that 'cause

you don't really know.

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But I'm putting this forward.

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I even suggested this to John as a topic

because I'm feeling actively challenged

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as a coach because I am this, I'm human

before I'm any role and I still wanna

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be my highest and best self as a coach.

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Thoughts.

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John: I, I'll say this.

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I think in life, not just in coaching,

in life, there's always a certain amount

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of pressure and expectation to show

up or respond, react in a particular

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Angie: Mm.

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John: And when you don't, when you

don't, when you, when you respond,

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when sound like curiosity, when

you have that sort of, oh, okay.

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That's interesting.

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Tell me more.

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Uh, rather than.

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Somebody who's expecting you

to be shocked or stunned or

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Angie: Sure.

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Yeah.

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John: not going into the emotion

that they, that they automatically

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went into, that they did.

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There's something's gonna come

up and say, Ooh, you are weird.

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Why aren't you doing what

everyone else around me's doing?

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Because, probably because as a coach

or someone in personal development,

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you've coached yourself out of it.

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You've trained yourself outta doing

that because you don't want to go

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through your life being reactive.

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You want to have control.

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It's what Tony Robbins calls your

personal, your personal power, right?

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You are in your personal power, so you get

to decide your, not a hundred percent, but

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you mostly get to decide your emotions.

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State and decide how you want to

be showing up, how you want to be

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reacting and responding in particular

situations or to particular things.

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And sometimes when that doesn't

happen for people, they think,

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oh, you are bloody weird.

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Don't like that.

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Angie: Yeah.

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Well, lemme ask you something.

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Do you have any, and this is a big

question, I think this is for anybody who

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is becoming a coach, thinking of becoming

a coach, uh, is, is um, a veteran coach.

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Um, but for you, I'm just asking you

right in this moment, do you have any.

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I don't say that I do or I don't, but

do you have any like deep lines in the

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sand that will make you say, you know

what, I need to step off and away from

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this because, okay, so I, again, I know

this can be like ooey, sticky, murky,

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controversial, so don't come at us people.

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We're just having a conversation.

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But are there any of those

that you would be willing to

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share with me and our audience?

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John: To, to a degree, and I, I'm probably

gonna keep it fairly general in how I

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discuss these, but I, I've, I'm, you

know, you know that I'm not religious.

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I'm not even really what you, I mean,

other than that I meditate and stuff.

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I'm not really what you do and

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Angie: Yeah, but that's spiritual.

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Yeah, yeah,

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Yeah.

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John: You, I could be defined

in it, in, in the, but I, I

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don't think of myself that way.

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Um, you know, I don't really believe

in the supernatural and stuff.

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Like, well, I'm open to it.

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I just don't have any evidence for it.

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And so, and so, you know, when,

when, if a client starts talking

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about another, their, their religious

beliefs or they start talking about,

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um, their chakras or they start

talking about, um, I don't know.

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I'm trying to think of other

things that aura or whatever.

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This is all stuff that.

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I don't believe in, but it's not my

job on the call to disabuse them of

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their belief or to bring them round to,

you know, to bring them into rational.

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I shouldn't say it that

way, but, uh, to, to

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Angie: Ah, but you did.

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John: But to rational, it's not my

job to rationalize their thoughts

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or to try and say, all right,

you should be thinking this way.

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I'm therefore for them, and that's

not what they've hired me for.

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And it's not even what I want to do.

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However, if, if something, if for

example, I had a client who, um,

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was really anti-gay, homophobic

maybe, and maybe that's tied into

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their religion or something like

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Angie: Mm-hmm.

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John: part one of their, one

of their goals is wanting to

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criminalize homosexuality in their

country or some other country.

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I can't work with that.

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I could not work with that.

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Um, and so, you know, it, it could

be, it could be to an extent as well

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that if somebody was supporting a war

or regime, that was, seemed like a, a

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big threat to the world and they are,

they want to be actively promoting

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that and helping that to happen.

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I would have to step away because

for me that would be, immoral uh,

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I could not be a part of that.

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So where think there are things

that will cross the line for me,

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Angie: Yes.

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John: there is also

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Angie: Have you ever stepped away though?

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Let me ask you

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have you ever had that experience

where you have stepped away?

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John: Yeah.

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Angie: Oh, see, and that's

the difference I have not yet.

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And again, and that's what I think

this is really about for me in bringing

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this up, is should we, as coaches

have some boundaries around ourselves?

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Right.

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Should we, and my personal answer was no.

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And okay.

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I wasn't looking at it that way.

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So let me be clear.

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I wasn't saying to myself like, what

are my personal boundaries as a coach?

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That wasn't it.

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But because of certain things coming up

and questions being, you know, posed.

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And things like that, I've taken

a step back and said, huh, I think

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I need to pay attention to this.

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And for me, I like yourself better,

late than never feel like I to be

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true to who I am as a coach, which

is to be as objective as I can, to

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be efficient, effective in all of the

things that we think make a great coach.

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And have made me a great coach, um, that

I need to set some boundaries for myself

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and I need to have some lines in the sand.

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Now I've had people that have shared

things with me that I didn't agree with.

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But it didn't prompt me, to want to maybe

think or do things differently as a coach.

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I just took it as part of who they

were as the whole and remain objective.

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But like yourself, I'm finding that there

are some moral questions and ethical

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questions and that doesn't mean that,

oh, I don't wanna work with somebody

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'cause they don't believe what I believe.

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don't,

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don't, don't misinterpret that.

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But if I'm being challenged in some

way, I'm human before I'm a coach too.

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And although trained and learning

how to manage ourselves and our

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emotions and things, it might be in

my best interest to maybe create some

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of those boundaries similar maybe

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to yours, right.

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John: Yeah.

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Look, if you are, if you are someone who

specifically wants to coach people who

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are Christian or people who are, um, Islam

Islamic, or people who are, um, atheist,

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for example, you can definitely do that.

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Uh, that's gonna be, that's gonna

be one of the things that you're

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gonna be qualifying people in.

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But that should also be clearing

your message in your marketing,

302

: 00:17:32

that that's who you're for.

303

: 00:17:34

But when you are, when you're on

the coaching for me, uh, there is

304

: 00:17:38

only one instance I can think where

I had to step away and I, we didn't

305

: 00:17:41

have to have a discussion about it.

306

: 00:17:42

I just said, I'm not the coach for you.

307

: 00:17:44

Angie: Right.

308

: 00:17:45

John: and I told the coaching company I

was working with why, and, um, this, this

309

: 00:17:49

was due to homophobia, like homophobic

things that coming up on the call.

310

: 00:17:53

I'm just not the right coach for you.

311

: 00:17:55

Angie: You're like, Hey, you're

going against everything that

312

: 00:17:57

I am and I can't work with you.

313

: 00:17:58

Sorry.

314

: 00:17:59

John: It wasn't just that though, I would

never, I would never be able to see that

315

: 00:18:05

person's greatest potential because I

would not be able to move past that.

316

: 00:18:08

Angie: Mm-hmm.

317

: 00:18:09

John: That's, that's really more the

issue is like, I can't get past that.

318

: 00:18:12

I, I can't deal with, I can't accept

that about you, and so I'm not gonna

319

: 00:18:16

be the right coach for you because I

don't, I don't like this particular

320

: 00:18:19

thing and I will want, I would want to

work on helping you to come outta that

321

: 00:18:26

to see, have a different perspective.

322

: 00:18:28

And that's not what the

coaching is actually for.

323

: 00:18:31

Um, I didn't, and in that situation

as well, I didn't think there was

324

: 00:18:34

gonna be a right coach for them.

325

: 00:18:35

We ended up.

326

: 00:18:36

Giving them a refund, um, because

the comp, the company itself did

327

: 00:18:41

not want to have a, a homophobic

client, which is definitely a, a

328

: 00:18:45

Angie: And listen, and that's their

choice and their right to have that.

329

: 00:18:47

I actually, I don't

330

: 00:18:48

know if you remember

this from a while back.

331

: 00:18:51

I, it just came to my mind.

332

: 00:18:53

I did have a client many, many,

many years ago that I was struggling

333

: 00:18:58

with, and he was not from the us.

334

: 00:19:00

Um, I doesn't matter where he was from.

335

: 00:19:02

Um, but he did come from a background

where women just weren't viewed equally.

336

: 00:19:11

Let's just leave it at that.

337

: 00:19:12

And I struggled.

338

: 00:19:13

I struggled through like six or

seven sessions and finally, um, and

339

: 00:19:18

I was working, you know, part-time

with a, a company at the time,

340

: 00:19:21

and that company said, you know,

let us listen to some sessions.

341

: 00:19:26

And, and they, they kind of said to me

like, you realize that he's just not gonna

342

: 00:19:31

agree with you because you're a woman.

343

: 00:19:33

And I didn't, I was like, really?

344

: 00:19:35

Um, he seemed game and energetic

and willing to be vulnerable until

345

: 00:19:40

we started doing the work and.

346

: 00:19:42

What was happening was I was

constantly being challenged.

347

: 00:19:46

I would hang up from that one

hour session, literally feeling

348

: 00:19:49

like I was on the treadmill

at high speed for eight hours.

349

: 00:19:52

I was mentally, physically,

and emotionally drained,

350

: 00:19:55

but I wasn't catching why.

351

: 00:19:57

So this kind of maybe falls into

that category of like, wait a second.

352

: 00:20:01

You know, so some things

I think can be deeper.

353

: 00:20:04

You know, some issues are deeper.

354

: 00:20:05

Some people are just not coachable

and that's easier to identify.

355

: 00:20:08

And I think it's easier for us as

coaches to step away because there's

356

: 00:20:13

a, a blame factor there, right?

357

: 00:20:16

Like they're just not

coachable at this time.

358

: 00:20:18

I've left the door open, I've

treated them professionally, but I

359

: 00:20:22

think when it hits us at our core.

360

: 00:20:25

Right, or in some personal way.

361

: 00:20:28

I don't know.

362

: 00:20:28

My daughter's a blonde.

363

: 00:20:29

Let me make this up.

364

: 00:20:31

If somebody was like, Ugh,

yeah, I can't stand blondes.

365

: 00:20:33

Blondes are the worst.

366

: 00:20:33

They're so stupid.

367

: 00:20:34

They're just, they're worthless.

368

: 00:20:36

They're, they should all be shot,

killed, and cooked and eaten.

369

: 00:20:38

I'm probably gonna have to give

myself permission to step away, right?

370

: 00:20:42

Because I do not have the

power, I might even say, really?

371

: 00:20:48

So what brought you to that conclusion?

372

: 00:20:50

I might be able to step into it

for a second and coach through it.

373

: 00:20:54

But

374

: 00:20:56

do I want to?

375

: 00:20:58

John: Yeah, I, I would also, I

would struggle to coach someone

376

: 00:21:02

who has such regressive or bigoted

views, uh, regardless of the reason

377

: 00:21:06

for them having that, if they were

particularly misogynistic or racist

378

: 00:21:11

or homophobic or, um, whatever it is.

379

: 00:21:14

I, I would not tolerate

that in a coaching session.

380

: 00:21:18

I wouldn't tolerate it from

anybody, to be honest with you.

381

: 00:21:20

I don't, I don't want to be around that.

382

: 00:21:23

And so, yeah, I would, I would

remove myself from that situation.

383

: 00:21:27

If I had to give someone their

money back, I would, it, it

384

: 00:21:29

generally doesn't happen though.

385

: 00:21:30

I guess people always have, always

have those senses of where those things

386

: 00:21:34

are appropriate, where they're maybe

less so than they used to, but, um,

387

: 00:21:39

Angie: Well, that's

the point though, John.

388

: 00:21:41

That's the point, is that I think this is

coming up a little more because I think,

389

: 00:21:46

listen, when you and I started coaching.

390

: 00:21:48

I don't think the world was perfect

and the people were per like, no.

391

: 00:21:52

But I think things have been changing

dramatically in recent decade.

392

: 00:21:59

Right.

393

: 00:21:59

The recent in, in, in the last decade.

394

: 00:22:01

And I noticed that within our

industry, things are changing.

395

: 00:22:05

I've seen a lot of people come

into coaching because they have a,

396

: 00:22:08

they have a mission and like you

said, well then stay in that lane.

397

: 00:22:13

And then I've seen a lot

of people leave this.

398

: 00:22:16

Believe it or not, industry because

they're like, uh, I give up.

399

: 00:22:20

I'm done.

400

: 00:22:22

I don't, that's not gonna happen for me.

401

: 00:22:24

But like again, as a coach and as

somebody who's always looking to

402

: 00:22:28

not just learn the next newest,

greatest book, technique, et cetera,

403

: 00:22:32

I also want to stay fully aware of.

404

: 00:22:35

Who I am and you know, am I be,

am I doing the best for me too?

405

: 00:22:42

Right?

406

: 00:22:43

This is not a unilateral

relationship with our clients.

407

: 00:22:47

They don't just get

permission to whatever.

408

: 00:22:53

And I did.

409

: 00:22:53

I, like I said, I had a couple of

spews in the last week and I was like,

410

: 00:22:57

okay, I wanna talk about this because

I've never felt compelled to do so.

411

: 00:23:04

I'm wondering how this session's, I

mean, how this episode's gonna go in

412

: 00:23:07

the ratings, but we've never really done

anything like this where we've actually

413

: 00:23:11

said, you know, how do you

handle everything as a coach,

414

: 00:23:16

John: Yeah.

415

: 00:23:17

Yeah.

416

: 00:23:17

I, I'm, I'm okay with being

presented with, um, sometimes know

417

: 00:23:22

contrarian or challenging opinions.

418

: 00:23:25

That's fine.

419

: 00:23:25

To a but to a point.

420

: 00:23:27

Right?

421

: 00:23:27

To a

422

: 00:23:28

Angie: Mm-hmm.

423

: 00:23:28

John: Um, because sometimes people

want to provoke and poke the bear

424

: 00:23:33

just for the sake of poke in the bear.

425

: 00:23:35

Sometimes people just want to see if

they can shock you, if they can get that

426

: 00:23:38

Angie: Mm-hmm.

427

: 00:23:39

John: be.

428

: 00:23:39

It generally doesn't happen with

clients, though I've not really had

429

: 00:23:42

that experience and I'd be interested

to hear from, from coaches who

430

: 00:23:48

Angie: Yeah.

431

: 00:23:49

Yeah.

432

: 00:23:50

John: trying to, trying to get a rise

out because that's, that's a sign

433

: 00:23:53

of, um, you know, a bit of toxicity

going on in that relationship and

434

: 00:23:57

probably not a good idea to continue

unless you can straighten that out.

435

: 00:24:01

Um, but, you know, but there's,

when there's big things going

436

: 00:24:04

on in the world, particularly.

437

: 00:24:07

You can't just pretend that they're not

happening, but you, I don't want them to

438

: 00:24:12

override everything that we are doing.

439

: 00:24:15

I spend some time in it, by all means,

but I don't want it to, to take us away

440

: 00:24:19

from the purpose of us working together.

441

: 00:24:22

But if somebody has a, you know, um,

having an emotional reaction to that, I

442

: 00:24:28

want them to have the emotional reaction,

even if I think, well, they're a bit.

443

: 00:24:33

You know, I might, I might think

that's a, I might think it's too much.

444

: 00:24:37

I, but then that, that's just me comparing

it to how I would react and respond, which

445

: 00:24:41

could be very, which we know is probably

very different, a bit less, uh, a bit less

446

: 00:24:46

emotional, a bit more controlled, usually

about where I want to be emotionally.

447

: 00:24:50

Um, I don't expect that of my

clients, so people are gonna go

448

: 00:24:54

to where they're going to get to.

449

: 00:24:56

Um, but yeah.

450

: 00:24:59

Am I addressing the right point here?

451

: 00:25:01

Angie: No, I think you are, but

I think, here's the thing, right?

452

: 00:25:04

So my, you know, my intention with

bringing this topic to our, in, into

453

: 00:25:09

our podcast is really, it's not, I'm

not looking to incite anybody, and

454

: 00:25:14

I don't want, I don't want anybody

coming and, and at us like, oh, well

455

: 00:25:18

you said this and I'm this, and.

456

: 00:25:20

That's not what it is.

457

: 00:25:21

I'm talking about being a coach and how

it is very difficult for us sometimes

458

: 00:25:26

to keep our humanness out of what we do.

459

: 00:25:32

And you know what I've kind of realized

in the past week, and again, I'm, I

460

: 00:25:37

keep mentioning that because there

were just things that have happened

461

: 00:25:40

and anniversaries of horrible things,

and that's not what this is about.

462

: 00:25:44

And what, what I realized is many, for

those of you that have been listening

463

: 00:25:48

to us from the very beginning, um, I

shared that I once had a client that

464

: 00:25:53

identified as a female genitalia.

465

: 00:25:58

And I remember sharing with you that.

466

: 00:26:02

Although it kind of like, uh, it gave me

pause 'cause I didn't expect to hear it.

467

: 00:26:07

And she asked me very straightforward,

do you have any issue with that?

468

: 00:26:11

And I said, no, but I have

a question for you as well.

469

: 00:26:14

And my question to her was, if you

remember, so tell me how that affects.

470

: 00:26:19

The coaching journey

that we're about to take.

471

: 00:26:21

'cause this was a very, very

new client session one, and she

472

: 00:26:25

says, I don't know if it will.

473

: 00:26:27

I said, okay, great.

474

: 00:26:27

Let's move forward.

475

: 00:26:29

So I would say that for me, in trying to

make sure that, number one, I'm not gonna

476

: 00:26:36

let anybody bring me into their bullshit.

477

: 00:26:37

I'm not even if they're

like, oh, I'm so upset.

478

: 00:26:41

Like we're, we don't do

that as coaches, right?

479

: 00:26:43

We need to take people

out of their bullshit.

480

: 00:26:45

So that's the first thing.

481

: 00:26:47

The second thing is.

482

: 00:26:48

Before I decide.

483

: 00:26:51

And I'm giving myself now

permission as a coach to do this

484

: 00:26:54

before I decide to step away.

485

: 00:26:57

I would kind of take the same positioning

that I did with this other client, right?

486

: 00:27:03

Because what she shared really

had nothing to do with me.

487

: 00:27:06

And not that I didn't

care, but I'm like, okay.

488

: 00:27:08

And I was actually kind of

thinking like, wow, interesting.

489

: 00:27:11

I was curious.

490

: 00:27:13

Oh, I was

491

: 00:27:14

curious.

492

: 00:27:14

So, right, if I bring that forward,

if somebody comes into a session and

493

: 00:27:19

they're just like guns blazing or

they're at all kind of, you know,

494

: 00:27:22

combative or looking to just spew, I

need to remain a coach in how I react,

495

: 00:27:29

and my reaction is, so I understand,

I'm hearing that this is how you feel.

496

: 00:27:35

Okay, so let me ask you, how is this

going to affect, does this have any real

497

: 00:27:40

impact on what we're discussing today?

498

: 00:27:42

John: Yeah.

499

: 00:27:43

Angie: And go into the more

like get out of their narrative

500

: 00:27:46

and more into the coaching.

501

: 00:27:48

And if they do turn around and say, well,

I'm just gonna go out there and KILL,

502

: 00:27:52

you know, any blonde, but then maybe

we have nothing to talk about anymore.

503

: 00:27:55

That's my decision.

504

: 00:27:56

But how I approach it can

still be uneventful even if

505

: 00:28:03

I'm feeling a little charged.

506

: 00:28:06

John: I think if I, if I was in

that same situation with having

507

: 00:28:09

that client who said, I, I.

508

: 00:28:11

Identify as a female body

part, and I would probably

509

: 00:28:15

Angie: Uhhuh Genitalia

specifically, please.

510

: 00:28:18

John: yes.

511

: 00:28:19

I, I would

512

: 00:28:20

Angie: I.

513

: 00:28:20

John: much the same stance of

like, okay, well, um, sure.

514

: 00:28:24

I, I would feel, I would feel a little

bit flawed of first, but I would,

515

: 00:28:26

I know I'd recover myself and like,

similarly to you, um, how's this gonna

516

: 00:28:30

impact our coaching relationship?

517

: 00:28:32

Well, it's probably not, uh, from

in my head I'd be going, unless

518

: 00:28:36

you're gonna spend our sessions

talking out of you, you know what?

519

: 00:28:39

Angie: Oh my gosh.

520

: 00:28:41

Well, listen, it did, listen.

521

: 00:28:42

I'm being honest.

522

: 00:28:43

It did come up later.

523

: 00:28:45

You know, she was telling

me about transcending and

524

: 00:28:47

I was very honest with her.

525

: 00:28:49

I said, this is new.

526

: 00:28:50

And I did share this in the first session.

527

: 00:28:51

Like, just so you know though,

I've never worked with somebody

528

: 00:28:55

that identified as this.

529

: 00:28:57

So if I lose, I said, you know,

if I lose focus or if I lack

530

: 00:29:02

understanding in a particular point.

531

: 00:29:06

Because of that, I need you to tell me

that because I lack experience there.

532

: 00:29:11

Are you okay with that?

533

: 00:29:13

So we had like a mutual understanding

about, and it wasn't about my

534

: 00:29:17

beliefs, it wasn't about politics,

religion, it was none of that.

535

: 00:29:23

And I don't believe that any of that

belongs in a session when you feel

536

: 00:29:29

like you could be, you as a coach,

could be incensed by something.

537

: 00:29:34

Other coaches that I've shared

that with, have shared with me

538

: 00:29:36

like, did you tell them to go B?

539

: 00:29:39

No, I didn't do that.

540

: 00:29:40

But that's their belief, not mine.

541

: 00:29:43

And they weren't trying

to impose it upon me.

542

: 00:29:46

John: Yeah, exactly.

543

: 00:29:46

Like if, uh, if a client told me that

they were a flat-earther or, um, that, uh,

544

: 00:29:52

I, I don't know, they believed in cons.

545

: 00:29:53

We, they didn't believe the moon

landing was real or something like that.

546

: 00:29:56

They're like, okay.

547

: 00:29:58

Again, doesn't, does

it affect our sessions?

548

: 00:30:00

Probably not.

549

: 00:30:01

Does it really, what impact

does it really have on us?

550

: 00:30:03

Unless the conspiracy theory rabbit

hole is starting to impact your life in

551

: 00:30:08

negative ways, which you definitely can

do for people, then probably we don't

552

: 00:30:12

need to spend too much time discussing it.

553

: 00:30:13

I don't need to disabuse you of that.

554

: 00:30:15

I don't agree with it.

555

: 00:30:16

But that there's this thing of

I, I generally don't think my

556

: 00:30:21

clients should have the first

clue what my personal beliefs are.

557

: 00:30:26

Really,

558

: 00:30:27

Angie: We talked about that, right?

559

: 00:30:28

What if people ask, Hey Angie,

like, do you celebrate Christmas?

560

: 00:30:32

Yes, I do.

561

: 00:30:33

But that still, you know,

leaves much to be desired.

562

: 00:30:36

And if they do ask or if they

become familiar or too curious.

563

: 00:30:40

I do, I just actively shut it

down and say, you know what?

564

: 00:30:43

I'm generally, here's my plexiglass.

565

: 00:30:46

You can see me, but you can't touch me.

566

: 00:30:49

And I think that's important to

keep it present no matter how

567

: 00:30:53

long you work with somebody.

568

: 00:30:55

John: And, and so if you can't,

if you can't switch off your own

569

: 00:30:58

internal commentary or your own

activism of that at appropriate

570

: 00:31:02

times, you are gonna be the one who

derails your coaching sessions rather

571

: 00:31:07

Angie: Well listen, isn't there

the counter to this, right?

572

: 00:31:09

Aren't there, do you think there

are not coaches that have very.

573

: 00:31:13

I don't know, hardcore hard nosed belief

systems and whatever it is, I don't care

574

: 00:31:18

if it's about, you know, I don't anti

eaters, I don't care what it is hardcore.

575

: 00:31:23

It is not our place to impose that either.

576

: 00:31:27

And you do have to be careful when you

do come to realize, even in a benign

577

: 00:31:31

way, that somebody's belief system.

578

: 00:31:34

I don't believe I, I, I don't know.

579

: 00:31:36

I don't understand anything

about identifying as a female.

580

: 00:31:39

I don't get it.

581

: 00:31:40

I don't.

582

: 00:31:41

Support it, but I don't not support it.

583

: 00:31:43

It's just not my belief plates, my system,

584

: 00:31:48

so,

585

: 00:31:48

John: should, yeah, there should

always be this a thing going on ahead

586

: 00:31:51

of, is this relevant to our coaching?

587

: 00:31:55

Do we need to get into this?

588

: 00:31:57

And certainly if, if something

has come out saying the same for

589

: 00:32:02

you, this is crossing a line for

me, or this is like making me

590

: 00:32:04

Angie: Sure.

591

: 00:32:05

John: uncomfortable as a coach, then you

do need to address whether or not you

592

: 00:32:08

can actually continue in the session or

continue with that client potentially.

593

: 00:32:13

Um, but for the, but for the

most part that, that stuff.

594

: 00:32:16

Try again.

595

: 00:32:16

That stuff shouldn't

596

: 00:32:17

Angie: easy.

597

: 00:32:18

John: Um, it shouldn't, it shouldn't

really be happening that you are even

598

: 00:32:22

trying to impose anything in sessions.

599

: 00:32:24

I mean, I do think some of these

coaches who do, some of these coaches

600

: 00:32:26

who do have very strong positions and

stance and things, you generally would

601

: 00:32:31

know that before working with them.

602

: 00:32:33

I would imagine, you know, if

603

: 00:32:35

Angie: You would hope.

604

: 00:32:36

yeah,

605

: 00:32:36

John: if you've gone and found, then

you're generally going to know that there

606

: 00:32:39

have been situations like, gosh, uh, a

coach, mentor guy I was working with,

607

: 00:32:44

um, definitely has some very political

politically different beliefs to me.

608

: 00:32:50

Um, however.

609

: 00:32:52

It maybe did slightly change my

opinion of him, but it didn't mean we

610

: 00:32:56

couldn't still work together or that

I didn't still respect his success

611

: 00:32:59

or his knowledge and expertise.

612

: 00:33:01

It was just something a little different.

613

: 00:33:03

Um,

614

: 00:33:04

Angie: Yeah.

615

: 00:33:04

John: it didn't, cause a rift

because it didn't need to.

616

: 00:33:07

But I think if there was a, a

situation where you, you know,

617

: 00:33:11

you think it's okay to, like, you

think it's someone who thinks it's

618

: 00:33:14

okay to own people or someone, uh,

619

: 00:33:16

Angie: Yeah.

620

: 00:33:17

Hello?

621

: 00:33:18

John: yeah, someone who

thinks that, um, you know, um.

622

: 00:33:21

People who are, uh, LGBT+ plus need

to be unalived or something like that.

623

: 00:33:28

We have a problem.

624

: 00:33:28

We're not gonna be able to see eye to eye.

625

: 00:33:30

And we we're crossing boundaries

of like you and I should.

626

: 00:33:34

We are in very separate

worlds that are not gonna mix.

627

: 00:33:37

It's like oil and water.

628

: 00:33:38

Yeah,

629

: 00:33:39

Angie: Listen, it's so interesting

and then I, I think I wanna kind

630

: 00:33:41

of trail off with this a little bit

because it is what we're talking about.

631

: 00:33:45

There's gonna be a million

different sides and opinions to

632

: 00:33:48

this and you and I know that and

it's okay because we welcome that.

633

: 00:33:51

We we're curious, we'd love to hear your

feedback on this or your experiences

634

: 00:33:56

that maybe went really well and maybe

some that didn't because to me that's

635

: 00:34:00

just all part of becoming a better

coach and better understanding.

636

: 00:34:03

But like.

637

: 00:34:04

Example, John and I work

together professionally.

638

: 00:34:07

We consider ourselves

to be very good friends.

639

: 00:34:09

We share things that you don't

even wanna know with each other.

640

: 00:34:12

However.

641

: 00:34:13

However, however, we also recognize

that we come from, even as coaches,

642

: 00:34:20

different backgrounds, different, right?

643

: 00:34:22

Different, different mannerisms.

644

: 00:34:25

You know, uh, you're sitting here saying

like, oh, I'm not very spiritual, even

645

: 00:34:29

like, I believe in this and not this.

646

: 00:34:31

And John knows I have a very deep

faith in spirit, but it's, we're still

647

: 00:34:36

able to work together professionally.

648

: 00:34:39

And I think because we still come to each

other with curiosity and not judgment

649

: 00:34:44

and, and not imposing, and I think that,

I'm bringing this up as a whole because.

650

: 00:34:51

It's a ti it's a season, right?

651

: 00:34:53

It like Jo, like John said, it doesn't

happen very often, but because it happened

652

: 00:34:58

to me twice I think that as coaches we

do have responsibilities or things that

653

: 00:35:04

we need to fuck even like, because these

things don't happen very often, maybe.

654

: 00:35:09

That we kind of still need to be

655

: 00:35:11

prepared for when it does,

and this is just a season.

656

: 00:35:13

It happened to me twice this past

657

: 00:35:15

week, which is why I wanted

to bring it up today.

658

: 00:35:19

And gain perspective.

659

: 00:35:20

Gain some perspective.

660

: 00:35:22

John: For me, some of this ties

in with professionalism as well.

661

: 00:35:26

'cause as much as I might say

on a, on an episode like this,

662

: 00:35:29

yeah, I'm not really very special.

663

: 00:35:31

You probably wouldn't hear me

say that on a coaching call.

664

: 00:35:33

Angie: Mm-hmm.

665

: 00:35:34

John: It is.

666

: 00:35:35

It's not really gonna come up,

especially if my client's talking

667

: 00:35:37

about, talking about their deep

faith and something like that.

668

: 00:35:40

I'm gonna listen, I'm gonna take it

on, is I don't, I don't have to share

669

: 00:35:44

their belief to be able to work with

670

: 00:35:46

Angie: Correct?

671

: 00:35:47

John: them.

672

: 00:35:48

Angie: Yes.

673

: 00:35:48

John: So, so it, it's, it's, it's

definitely important and it, yeah,

674

: 00:35:52

I, I do also think your, your

clients don't need you to believe

675

: 00:35:56

exactly what they believe either.

676

: 00:35:57

They just need you to be that

person holding the space, asking

677

: 00:36:01

the questions, listening actively.

678

: 00:36:04

And sometimes you might just

need to acknowledge with them,

679

: 00:36:07

uh, something that's going on.

680

: 00:36:09

You know, check in with them.

681

: 00:36:10

What's on, what's your mind?

682

: 00:36:11

Is anything.

683

: 00:36:12

Coming up for you if, especially if you

can see some agitation or distraction

684

: 00:36:16

going on for them and get it out there.

685

: 00:36:20

Get out, let them, let them

say what they need to say.

686

: 00:36:22

But if you join them in that it

687

: 00:36:25

Angie: Oh, no.

688

: 00:36:26

Right.

689

: 00:36:26

Like, well, here's the thing, right?

690

: 00:36:28

Like I said earlier, we don't want to

contribute to whatever the negative is.

691

: 00:36:32

And I just think that what I would

love to ask our listeners for is this

692

: 00:36:37

really, this is about like, do you

have any lines in the sand as a coach?

693

: 00:36:42

Just curious because I

never have, and I mean I'm,

694

: 00:36:48

maybe, I don't know that I have,

but um, generally I haven't

695

: 00:36:52

had to even consider that.

696

: 00:36:53

So I'm just curious as to anybody

else that has had experiences with

697

: 00:36:57

that, how they manage it, navigate it.

698

: 00:37:00

Um, questions for us

about more of this even.

699

: 00:37:05

John: leave a comment and we'd love to,

700

: 00:37:07

Angie: Yeah, I love that.

701

: 00:37:08

All right.

702

: 00:37:09

John: Absolutely.

703

: 00:37:10

Alright.

704

: 00:37:10

Good stuff, Angie.

705

: 00:37:11

Uh, let's come by next time and we'll pick

something maybe a bit less controversial.

706

: 00:37:17

Angie: Oh, John, come on.

707

: 00:37:18

Once in a while you have to

throw some pepper in the sauce.

708

: 00:37:21

John: I agree.

709

: 00:37:22

All right.

710

: 00:37:23

See you time.

711

: 00:37:24

Angie: Bye for now.